film - interview with ben bays

Your upcoming film The Horseman looks extremely moody and atmospheric. How much work went
into creating this world?
Well, the overall feel, mood, vibe, and the production design really drives the film itself. It's always been first
and foremost in our minds when we're creating a picture like this. My production designer Chris Clapp was a
huge help and influence. We talked at length about all types of things, like how this was a very rural setting and
a very small village. What would they have? There was a lot of research into period items and what types of
things would be around. Especially on a low budget, you can't just open the floodgates and get all of these
perfect period elements or have them craft-made. (Laughs) You have to find them, you have to develop them.
So we spent several months trying to accumulate all of the elements to keep the movie and its mood consistent.

How difficult is it to pull off a period piece on a limited budget? What are some of the logistical
challenges?
We always start off with the idea first. We dream big and then we think "Okay, now how do we make this
happen?" And how do we make it happen and still retain a certain amount of quality? There's the old pyramid
of production-the triangle production. There's three elements to it: good, cheap, and fast. You can pick two of
those. You can't have all three. (Laughs) So we're always riding that line between doing it on the cheap and
retaining a certain amount of quality. Usually, the sacrifice is your comfort level. Especially with The
Horseman, logistically, it was a very difficult shoot.

We were trying to cram the whole thing into eight days. We were shooting in very remote locations with no
support facilities. We didn't have trailers or StarWagons. We were out in the middle of nowhere. It was a
challenge across the board but, at the same time, it's one of the reasons I like making films like this. I want to
do something that is challenging. I don't want to do something that comes easily to me. I want to see if I can
make it happen.

When you start making a film like The Horseman, how do you begin the process? You say you
"dream big," so how much pre-production do work you do?
We have some concept art done at the beginning. Again, a lot of it's limited by the budget. I (as much as I can)
storyboard out the whole film.

You do the storyboards yourself?
Yeah, I'll do my little stick-figure drawings and hope people can interpret them. (Laughs) In some cases, based
on time, I'm not always able to do that. I prefer doing that when I'm able to.

Does this aid your process?
Yes. And again, this hasn't always been the case logistically because filmmaking is such a difficult thing. I've
found out that when I'm unable to do that, the filmmaking process is much more difficult. When I've
storyboarded out the whole scene, it's very easy for everybody else to follow it and get behind it. On my feature
film Blind Justice, we storyboarded an action sequence that took place where a couple of mobsters come in and
shoot up an apartment. We storyboarded every shot. We shot it over of a period of two days and that was the
smoothest sequence of the whole film to shoot because everyone could look at the drawing you'd posted up
and move forward accordingly.

You've worked with many of your crewmembers before, as well as one of The Horseman's leads,
Melinda Page Hamilton. Do you prefer working with the same people?
In the case of Melinda, she's such a wonderful actress. When I worked with her on Driftwood, which is a short
film that I produced, I wanted to have the chance to work with her on another project. I was incredibly glad
and honored that she responded to the [Horseman] script and liked the character. She's fabulous. There's a
certain level of comfort when you're working with someone as talented as she is, because you know you're
going to get great stuff every take. There's also part of me that wants to branch out and try new things with new
actors. There's that side of me, too. It's split right down the middle.

Each of your short films could be expanded into something larger. If you had the opportunity to
develop The Horseman into a feature-length film, what would you do differently? Would you bring the
same cast and crew back?
It's funny you bring this up because we are actually working on a feature version of the film right now. As far as
bringing back the same crew and cast, a lot of that would depend on how we went about doing it and if they'd
be interested in coming back to work on it. Story-wise, the film itself would be obviously restructured for a
three-act structure. It's certainly more of a commercially viable piece than, say, a short film which has its own
structure that doesn't necessarily doesn't take you on the same journey.

The Horseman is one of the very first films ever shot with the RED ONE camera. Why did you go with
something brand-new and virtually untested?
Well, we've been following the RED ONE since they were talking about releasing this camera very closely. We
thought the idea of a 4K imaging system that looked like film-and, in some cases, better than film-was
something we wanted to use and we felt it would make our film look amazing. We never thought that it would
be released at the time, or we would have access to it at the time, that we did. We were planning on shooting
this on the HVX200, which is Panasonic's prosumer camera that shoots hi-def and it's great for indie
filmmakers. When the RED ONE looked like it was going to be released about a month before our shoot date,
we decided to throw it out there to see if we might get access to one … and we did. We just plugged it right
into our production pipeline and ended up using [the RED ONE] instead. I'm so glad we did; it stepped the
film up a notch and it looks phenomenal. It's such an amazing camera.

Do you embrace the challenges and limitations of independent filmmaking? In other words, do you
think money helps or hinders the filmmaking process?
Both, to a certain degree, I think. It's all on a sliding scale. At our level, where we're self-financed and it's so
low budget (I think people would actually be surprised how low of a budget The Horseman was), money would
certainly help in a number of ways. I think when you have limitless resources and hundreds of hundreds of
millions of dollars, there's a point you reach instead of asking "How do we approach this scene from a creative
standpoint?", there's a tendency to throw money at problems. Instead, it's "Well, we'll do something here or
we'll do CG here" and it's easier to do that than to sit down and really think through a problem. Usually, when
we're faced with that (because we have no other alternative, we don't have the money to throw at it), we come
up with some really interesting ways of doing a scene or a really interesting look at it than we would not have
otherwise.

You are intimately involved in all aspects of your films, not just directing them. Do you have a strong
idea of how everything is "supposed" to be?
Yeah, I'm a bit of a control freak at times. (Laughs) I love all of the aspects of the filmmaking process. When I
start out, I have this very specific idea of what the movie is supposed to be in my head from the beginning. I
love working really closely with the composer and the sound designer on the music. That being said, you're only
as good as the crew and the support team you have with you. I'd be a fool to think that I have all the perfect
answers. I have such a great group of people that I've worked with who bring so many good ideas and talents to
the table, that they augment the original idea or the core thing. There's nothing more exciting than having
someone come alongside your vision, help augment it, and turn it into something than you might not have seen
completely on your own.

Are you ever surprised by how a scene turned out? Has something turned out differently than you
expected, for better or for worse?
Yeah. Specifically in The Truck Driver, there's a scene where the character Jack Grill and Michael Owens's father
are talking. They are debating what to do with the young son, Michael, because he's just discovered this
horrible thing in the back of the truck. It was originally written as a very narrative scene. It was a
conversation-they talked, we got information out of it. When we were at that point in the movie, we were
looking at, and it just wasn't playing right. We'd built up this scene and the tone, the beats of it, weren't
working.

Someone suggested to me, "Why not cut it all out and try it from the perspective of the kid?" We'd noticed that
we had all of these inbetween shots (the whole scene was shot handheld). We had two cameras. We would yell
"Cut," the camera operators would pull the camera down, then hit the "Record" button to stop the tape. We
were looking through all of the dailies and noticed we had all of this crazy footage that was handheld and
moving all over the place and jumpy from those "cut moments." And we thought: Let's take those and chop
them all together really fast and sound design will augment it. And I think what it ended up doing was take a
scene that was, on its own, pretty flat and turned it into something that made the moment more compelling. So,
from that standpoint, it was interesting to step back and go, "Wow, I didn't conceive it that way." Based on a
problem that we discovered-we couldn't just go back reshoot it and, again, throw money at it-we had to solve it
from a creative standpoint. I think it makes the scene better as a result.

With The Truck Driver, what is ostensibly a thriller turns out to be a pretty endearing father-son story.
How much work do you typically do with actors to develop their roles and relationships?
Yeah, we try to talk through it as much as possible. I'll sit down with an actor ahead of time and talk through
their character. Hopefully, a lot of it comes from them. Maybe they'll have several ideas of how they see the
character. It's more of a conversation between myself and the actor. Unfortunately, due to logistics and the way
these projects have worked for me, I haven't had a lot of opportunity to do advanced rehearsals ahead of time.
It's something I would love to do down the road when our budgets get bigger, hopefully, and our timeframes get
bigger.

Do you invite creative collaboration with your casts and crews?
I really do invite a lot of collaboration with the actors. I used to (not so much now) be a control freak.
Something I'm learning as I get older and do more of these is: the idea that I write this character is the character
of a story, but then you cast it with this flesh-and-blood person, who is similar to the character who you were
thinking of, but they're their own person with their own thoughts and their own ideas. And it's up to them, the
actor, to incorporate that into their own person. For me to try to micro-manage that, I've found that it doesn't
work as well as turning it over to someone who is very accomplished. They'll take it into a direction that I
didn't see or couldn't see because they're the person living it.

What are a few movies or directors that continue to inspire you and inform your work?
I think Steven Spielberg, but everyone says Steven Spielberg. (Laughs) He really is someone who's influenced
me ever since I was a little kid and wanted to do this. There's a certain scope and magic to his films. James
Cameron is probably the one I identify with on a tone or concept level. I think Jim Cameron has such a tour de
force of vision and scope. There's a certain amount of uncompromising that he does that I admire. Terminator 2
was actually the first movie that, when I saw it, I went: "I have to do this for a living; I have to somehow make
this work." It was one of those movies that combined every single element in such a massive way: special
effects, visual effects, makeup, great story, fun action. I thought it was put together so well. I think Christopher
Nolan, right now, is one of my favorite directors. His attention to detail and character and story are so precise.

Did you see Nolan's The Dark Knight?
I did. I just thought it was phenomenal. I think [Nolan] is so amazing. Even the little films that he does
inbetween the big ones that get all the acclaim are amazing. He has a sensibility that I really admire.

Speaking of James Cameron, you ended up interning for his company, Lightstorm Entertainment.
What was that experience like?
Yeah, it was great. He's the guy who I studied his movies for years and now, I was making copies and shuffling
paperwork through his office. It was just an amazing experience. It was a great group of people. I tell stories
about going down into their art vaults and look at their original concept art for Aliens and look at the police
uniform that the Terminator wore in Terminator 2--the actual one with the giant metallic arms. It was a great
experience.

You've directed episodes of the Emmy-nominated children's show Taylor's Attic, which is a far cry
from your current work. Is it difficult for you to shift from an educational show featuring puppets to
doing gritty, dramatic narratives?
I wouldn't describe it as difficult; I look at it as more of a reprieve from one to the other. Taylor's Attic is
definitely my day job, but it's something that's fun and unique. It just exercises such a different set of skills and
muscles that I don't get to exercise with the other work I enjoy doing. Taylor's Attic is a fun show-it's quirky, it's
funny. It has a lot of unique challenges on its own. I really enjoy it.

What are your thoughts about today's film industry? How is it changing? In your opinion, where is it
all heading?
Well, I think the industry, in terms of what people want to see, is like a swinging pendulum. It definitely comes
in eras and changes from one decade to the next. I definitely think, for at least the last ten, twenty years, the
focus has been on eye candy and visual effects and technology-big, big scope movies. I think it's starting (if it
hasn't already) to reach its apex and will swing back the other way. I think right now, because of tools and
equipment like the RED camera, filmmaking is becoming accessible to such a huge amount of people that the
pendulum is going to swing back toward story. Story, story, story. Everyone will have the ability to do all of
these wonderful visual effects. You're not limited by anything other than your imagination anymore. Now it's
going to be about who can tell the best story, who can put together the best overall film.

Like the music industry, there's a certain amount of oversaturation that's happening because the technology
became available to everybody. Every garage band can suddenly cut a CD and post it on the Internet and get
their music out there. I think the same thing is happening with the film industry. You can, for the price of a
desktop computer, a little bit of software, and the right cameras, have your own movie studio. It just comes
down to your imagination.

Room 101 Productions is your production shingle, shared with three others. What is everyone's role
while working on a given film?
Overall, I'll come up with a concept or an idea for a film that fits the general direction of the company. Chad
Dutka, who is my producer, will sit down and start figuring out different ways to put it together. [Associate
producers] Ryan Wentz and Fran Kelsey were with us when we formed the company several years ago. They're
a giant support group, whether that's financially or logistically, to get the film made.

Where did the name Room 101 come from?
(Laughs) There was a video-editing room called Room 101 where I spent most of my time cutting together my
little movies. We called it Room 101 Productions and the name kind of stuck. We just kind of like the idea of
it: it seems like this low-budget, lo-fi idea. A small room where ideas can happen.

It seems that you're always doing something creatively and that your mind is always going. What are
you working on now, and what do you plan to do next?
Well, we're finishing the short film The Horseman first and then working on a feature-length version of it. I'm
also working with [filmmaker] Vidas Barzdukas on a horror feature as well. Also on the side, I'm working a
couple of television projects but I can't talk too much about them. They're all in development.

Thanks for your time.
Thank you, Paul.

For more on Ben Bays and his films, visit www.room101productions.com.